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Walker defies Army attempt to fence Common
10:46am Monday 16th July 2007
Comments (30)"OVER my dead body."
That was a dog walker's reaction today to news that army chiefs are looking into fencing off 680 acres of common land around firing ranges near York.
Peter Coates, 63, of Haxby, has been walking his pets on Strensall Common for 40 years without coming to any harm.
He claims fencing off the land would breach historic rights of access to the common.
"It seems they are deliberately trying to stop people walking on Strensall Common," he said.
Mr Coates spoke out after army officers told of their increasing concerns for the safety of walkers who were going into areas near ranges during firing sessions, where they could be hit by stray or ricochetting bullets.
The officers told The Press on Friday how they were looking into the legalities of erecting a fence around the danger area. They claimed some walkers were ignoring requests to stay clear of the danger zone, forcing firing training sessions to be suspended.
They said there had been seven such incursions in the past seven days, and one such walker had been visited by Ministry of Defence police officers after being traced to his home.
Mr Coates contacted The Press to say he was the walker being referred to, but claimed he had only gone into the end of the so-called danger area where he was nearly two miles beyond the stop butts used on the ranges.
He said there were many trees between him and the ranges, and he was at no greater risk than someone standing, for example, on a nearby golf course or visiting a nearby farm shop.
He felt the danger zone was unnecessarily restrictive and questioned the accuracy of the army's calculations.
He said two men had come rushing up to him when he was walking on the common, telling him to stop, but he had no idea who they were and had simply carried on walking.
He said that after later being spoken to by the MoD police, he had agreed to try to avoid the zone, but he still felt the army was being too restrictive.
An army spokesman denied that it wanted to restrict access to the common, and said the fence option would only be pursued if people could not be persuaded to stop going into the danger area during firing sessions.
"We encourage people to go on to the common," he claimed. He defended the accuracy of the calculations used to decide which parts of the common were at risk during firing, saying they had been made by experts.
Your Say YourYork Press
Geoff, says...
10:59am Mon 16 Jul 07
Notices should warn people of the danger should they cross into the pegged when shooting is happening!
Simple init?
boots2386, york says...
11:02am Mon 16 Jul 07
Jimbob, York says...
11:13am Mon 16 Jul 07
He felt the danger zone was unnecessarily restrictive and questioned the accuracy of the army's calculations.
Err, ok. Lets have a look at his calculations then?!
Alternatively, they could just get him to sign some kind of waiver so if he gets hurt there's no comeback on the Army.
Stupid old fool.
ME, York says...
11:30am Mon 16 Jul 07
He said two men had come rushing up to him when he was walking on the common, telling him to stop, but he had no idea who they were and had simply carried on walking
Of course, two squaddies in uniform carrying guns running towards you are really difficult to recognise!!
neddy, york says...
11:32am Mon 16 Jul 07
bjb, York says...
11:41am Mon 16 Jul 07
Cynic, York says...
11:42am Mon 16 Jul 07
No doubt if he or his dogs were injured by a bullet he would be the first to complain. On what grounds exactly is he questioning the army's claims about the size of the danger zone? Is he an expert in ballistics?
XXX, York says...
12:28pm Mon 16 Jul 07
boots2386 wrote:well so far I dont ever recall anybody taking a round on strensall common. Maybe I am wrong but I guess I am not. Leave it be. I cant understand the hype
maybe Mr coates would like to see what the effect of 5.56mm round would do to the human body even at 2 miles it makes a nasty mess but it seems it a case of it will not happen to me. and before anybody asks i HAVE SEEN THE EFFECTS
GDave, York says...
1:07pm Mon 16 Jul 07
GDave, York says...
1:09pm Mon 16 Jul 07
A user, Selby says...
1:27pm Mon 16 Jul 07
Jimbob, York says...
1:39pm Mon 16 Jul 07
Cari, York says...
1:40pm Mon 16 Jul 07
neddy wrote:Have to admit, I'm not aware of anything stopping horse riders (I too enjoy horseriding and have done for many years) riding on common land, the same principles apply to horse riders as to walkers. If there are signs up warning of the dangers and to keep out then this applies to everyone. Although personally I don't think I'd want to take my horse near somewhere where they are shooting. She's not the sanist of animals.
Does anyone know if you're still allowed to ride horses on the common
as been told that we aren't however I can't see how they can stop us
since it's common land.
Jimbob, York says...
1:40pm Mon 16 Jul 07
Allsorts, York says...
1:41pm Mon 16 Jul 07
Well I'm sure that could easily be a possibility!
I cannot believe some people could really be so foolish!
I like open spaces etc...I like my life more!
PSi, York says...
2:31pm Mon 16 Jul 07
Most of the Common is owned by the MoD and they 'allow' the public access.
Horses are covered in a by-law and are not allowed on the common.
Mr. Coats was confronted by the Range Warden and the Commondant who were trying to keep not only him safe but his others, and from what I hear he was rude and berlligerent.
What is also not mentioned is that due to people like this the range has been shut down on a number of occasions risking both staff jobs and those who need training as part of their service overseas. If Mr. Coats knew that would he have told the two men where to go? Oh yes and he was probably in the most dangerous place, although he exagerates by saying two miles, if a stray bullet went through as they are accurate to greater distances.
Bullets and guns are not toys. They go through you and leave a mess, and it only takes one!!!
neddy, york says...
3:25pm Mon 16 Jul 07
Horses are covered in a by-law and are not allowed on the common."
So since when have horses not being allowed on the common? Is it not called Strensall Common for a reason? Its ridiculous, people hate horses being on the road and now were being stopped for riding on a place like Strensall common, where we keep out of the way of traffic since we are not stupid, dont go anywhere near the firing range when the flags are up. What harm exactly are we causing?
neddy, york says...
3:26pm Mon 16 Jul 07
So since when have horses not being allowed on the common? Is it not called Strensall Common for a reason? Its ridiculous, people hate horses being on the road and now were being stopped for riding on a place like Strensall common, where we keep out of the way of traffic since we are not stupid, dont go anywhere near the firing range when the flags are up. What harm exactly are we causing?
Bemused, says...
4:31pm Mon 16 Jul 07
Defence Estates
The Countryside and Rights of Way Act 2000 gives people the opportunity to walk freely across mapped access landwithout having to stay on linear routes. The new rights under the Act cover most recreational activities undertaken on foot, such as walking, running, climbing and birdwatching. However, it does not include horse-riding, cycling or any motorised access, and activities such as camping and the lighting of fires .........
There are situations arising where we do not have byelaws in place
but where public access is not appropriate. In these situations (in
England and Wales),we can apply a direction under Section 28 of the
Act, which can restrict/exclude the public from any area of land for the
purposes of defence.
neddy, york says...
4:36pm Mon 16 Jul 07
Bemused, says...
4:48pm Mon 16 Jul 07
Google on "Horse rising Strensall common."
Click on the result "Welcome to the new structure of DEs Environmental Support Team ..."
Bemused, says...
4:49pm Mon 16 Jul 07
Jimbob, York says...
4:52pm Mon 16 Jul 07
PSi, York says...
5:37pm Mon 16 Jul 07
jobsagudun, york says...
5:46pm Mon 16 Jul 07
JAL, York says...
8:58pm Mon 16 Jul 07
neddy wrote:Another popular misconception. The public do not have right of access to common land. Rights of common (grazing sheep, gathering wood etc) were bestowed on "commoners" centuries ago and are inherited or passed on. On the main point, firing ranges are dangerous places. Whether anyone has been hurt or worse at Strensall is immaterial. What's wrong with fencing it? There are plenty of places to walk dogs in safety. As an ex-serviceman it just gets up my nose with these R Soles demanding their rights! On second thoughts, let them have their rights and risk a stray round.
Does anyone know if you're still allowed to ride horses on the common as been told that we aren't however I can't see how they can stop us since it's common land.
TG, says...
11:18pm Mon 16 Jul 07
Presov, york says...
4:46pm Wed 18 Jul 07
Unless todays clever Army are using magic bullets that can penetrate 60 feet of earth butts then weave a course through 300 acres of dense woodland you are safer than crossing the road. Get it right fools
PSi, York says...
9:10pm Wed 18 Jul 07
Peter Coates with his dogs, Oscar and Maisie
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boots2386, york says...
10:55am Mon 16 Jul 07
and before anybody asks i HAVE SEEN THE EFFECTS