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To dual or not to dual York’s busy ring road?
8:00am Friday 28th September 2007
Comments (48)THE campaign to dual York's northern ring road will go national next week when a prospective MP calls for "urgent" action.
Julian Sturdy, the prospective Conservative candidate for the new York Outer seat, will address his party's national conference in Blackpool. He will say York needs the A1237 dualled.
Mr Sturdy said: "Congestion on the York northern ring road is starting to have a real impact on the local economy and quality of life. There has to be continued investment in our infrastructure or we will simply grind to a halt.
"There is a strong local feeling from businesses, workers and commuters on this issue and they feel that for too long their concerns have been ignored.
"I shall be raising its profile by highlighting this issue at the Conservative conference in Blackpool. It's crucial that action is taken to prevent the daily gridlock which is having a considerable spin-off effect on the local economy and people's quality of life."
Mr Sturdy will be speaking at a York Conservatives fringe event on Monday, along with Yorkshire and Humber MEP Timothy Kirkhope, leader of the Conservative MEPs.
Back in June, the much-awaited Future York report called for the A1237 to be dualled.
Mr Sturdy said he had urged City of York Council and the Government to work together to plan for the long-term future of York, including the upgrade of the ring road to a dual carriage way.
Mr Sturdy has also launched a 10 Downing Street petition calling for the road to be dualled - but a rival petition has also now been set up in opposition.
The counter-motion reads: "We the undersigned petition the Prime Minister to look at alternative solutions to dualling the A1237 ring road around York. Although dualling may temporarily ease congestion on the ring road, the dualling would also unleash suppressed demand, so increasing the number of vehicle journeys along it. The millions of pounds required for such a project could be used instead to invest funds in public transport to help reduce congestion on the current ring road."
By yesterday, Mr Sturdy's petition had attracted 359 signatures, while the opposing one had 84.
Next week, city councillors will also be asked to back a motion calling on the Government to provide funding for the road to be made a dual carriageway.
Local Conservative leader Ian Gillies will table the motion next Thursday.
Your Say YourYork Press
york_lad, York says...
8:39am Fri 28 Sep 07
The main problem is all the roundabouts, make the major ones into flyovers and this would keep the traffic moving.
Alan Shaw, Bootham says...
8:39am Fri 28 Sep 07
YORKIE, york says...
8:42am Fri 28 Sep 07
YORKIE, york says...
8:48am Fri 28 Sep 07
A user, Selby says...
9:45am Fri 28 Sep 07
XXX, says...
9:47am Fri 28 Sep 07
Alan Shaw wrote:What a load of s**** Do you think if the 1237 was made into a dual carriageway that twice as many people would use it. Absolute rubbish. Tell me how it will increase traffic. Maybe more traffic would use the road instead of trying to go thorugh the city causing more chaos. The same amount of cars will be on the road. People dont go out and buy an extra car just because Yorks got a new road. They try and take the best route from A to B. public transport is a joke. Sounds like you sit on a bean bag. So sitting in the constant SNARL UPS my only thought and I guess the same as everybody else that lives on planet earth, Make this bloody road a dual carriageway. Considerate to the planet???. Do you have a mobile phone. Sky tv. etc etc... A guess would say probably most of us own these things. How many launches into space happens to put these sattelites into orbit to use these gadgets. Wake up. Carbon Foot Print. Its the latest bo**ck* that the bean bag brigade rant on about. Makes me want to go out and buy a 4x4 just to p*** the likes of you off
The introduction of dual carriageway on the York ring road will only encourage a vast increase in traffic, harming the environment even more so. At least with the snarl ups that exist now on single carriageway, people are thinking more about public transport. Homes should have to pay excessive tax if they have more than 1 car per household and even that car must be in line with those having the least emissions. The more people that use public transport will engender mutual benefits for the planet and users as the council will put the infrastructure in place to support demand. Say no to dual carriageway on the Northern ring road and lets be considerate to the planet and think about our carbon footprint.
Mullarkian, York says...
9:48am Fri 28 Sep 07
XXX, says...
9:51am Fri 28 Sep 07
Mullarkian wrote:Hit it on the nose
Which planet is Alan Shaw on? Certainly not this one if he believes all that tosh that government sponsored scientists spout about carbon foot prints and the environment. All that is, is another excuse to tax people more.
ouserower, york says...
9:54am Fri 28 Sep 07
PSi, York says...
9:58am Fri 28 Sep 07
ouserower wrote:True. I spoke with someone who was around when the first study was done and he admitted that they failed to take into consideration York developing, more people in cars, cr*p public transport and the cost of single road suited at the time!
This road was stuffed from the beginning. Tiny road and followed by all the development. Crazy. What York now needs is a totally new north ring road a mile further out. Trying to turn the current on to dual carriageway would be murder!
Captain Jack Sparrow, Strensall says...
9:58am Fri 28 Sep 07
In terms of carbon footprints - there's absolutely nothing you can do to stop what is happening to the earth. It's going to get much, much warmer and resources and food will become scarcer. You can wheel out your wheelie bins full of stuff to be recycled. You can drive cars with cleaner engines, there's all sorts you can do.
But when the biggest nations on Earth (USA, Russia, China) continue to polute and rape the earth as they do, there isn't much chance.
A user, Selby says...
10:01am Fri 28 Sep 07
akuma, York says...
10:46am Fri 28 Sep 07
Noddy1, York says...
10:55am Fri 28 Sep 07
york_lad wrote:If it was a duel carriageway you wouldn't need roundabouts.
Making the ring road a dual carriage will only ease the problem. The main problem is all the roundabouts, make the major ones into flyovers and this would keep the traffic moving.
I see Alan Shaw has commented again (serios Echo warrior)
Face it Alan people are to lazy to walk or cycle and will take thier cars.
To just make one point, if as some cllrs have suggested that each roundabout gets a fly over instead of a duel carriageway THIS WILL COST TWICE AS MUCH TO DO. I can't see the A1237 ever being dueled. Even if you win tonights euro lottery you would still be a £100 million short of the cost of dueling it.
Geoff, says...
11:04am Fri 28 Sep 07
Alan Shaw wrote:It's this kind of stupid uninformed claptrap that stops us moving forward and doing something.
The introduction of dual carriageway on the York ring road will only encourage a vast increase in traffic, harming the environment even more so. At least with the snarl ups that exist now on single carriageway, people are thinking more about public transport. Homes should have to pay excessive tax if they have more than 1 car per household and even that car must be in line with those having the least emissions. The more people that use public transport will engender mutual benefits for the planet and users as the council will put the infrastructure in place to support demand. Say no to dual carriageway on the Northern ring road and lets be considerate to the planet and think about our carbon footprint.
Dual the ringroad and put in flyovers where possible. Clost the junctions where flyovers are not possible.
The purpose of a ringroad is to get people round the city to their destination.
YORKIE, york says...
11:08am Fri 28 Sep 07
http://petitions.pm.
gov.uk/DualYorkringr
oad/?signed=b62083d.
89f9f0
RikRock, York says...
12:00pm Fri 28 Sep 07
Dualling the ring road is a green solution, it would help the environment - because cars would be driving more efficiently, in top gear and therefore producing less emissions per mile.
Surely all the stop/start traffic jams and moving along slowly in first gear is worse for the environment, so looking at the bigger picture, a dual carriageway would suit everyone in the long run.
Axe Man Jack, York says...
12:38pm Fri 28 Sep 07
A user, Selby says...
12:41pm Fri 28 Sep 07
Sure would be worth seeing tho!!
AMD, Not on the A1237 car park says...
12:43pm Fri 28 Sep 07
Cari, York says...
12:50pm Fri 28 Sep 07
Face it Alan people are to lazy to walk or cycle and will take thier cars.
I'm not lazy. It's just not possible to carry a saddle, hat, whip, boots, feed, shavings, hay, straw or any combination of the above on a bike or on the bus. I get strange enough looks in Tesco, and they now sell some of this stuff!!!
Cari, York says...
12:52pm Fri 28 Sep 07
Dual the ringroad and put in flyovers where possible. Clost the junctions where flyovers are not possible.
The purpose of a ringroad is to get people round the city to their destination.
And what about all those that due to the closure of some of the junctions have to travel further to get to their destinations?
mrandyc, York says...
12:55pm Fri 28 Sep 07
YORKIE wrote:And the counter petition is at http://petitions.pm.
Everybody for this, sign the Government petition.
http://petitions.pm.
gov.uk/DualYorkringr
oad/?signed=b62083d.
89f9f0
gov.uk/noA1237dualli
ng/
Peter, york says...
12:56pm Fri 28 Sep 07
akuma, York says...
12:59pm Fri 28 Sep 07
Peter wrote:Those roundabouts wouldn't be that bad if people only knew how to read road markings, or if they can read them, obey them, don't block the exits!!!
Something definitely needs doing about the Hopgrove roundabouts, if there was ever a lesson in how not to do road design this is it, in summer it can take over 2 hours to get from the Monks Cross roundabout on the A1237 onto the west bound carriageway on the A64, which forces drivers to go through York as it is a darn sight quicker. A ringroad should take traffic out of cities not force it into them.
Peter, york says...
1:06pm Fri 28 Sep 07
akuma wrote:What do suggest then a Policeman there all day?
Peter wrote: Something definitely needs doing about the Hopgrove roundabouts, if there was ever a lesson in how not to do road design this is it, in summer it can take over 2 hours to get from the Monks Cross roundabout on the A1237 onto the west bound carriageway on the A64, which forces drivers to go through York as it is a darn sight quicker. A ringroad should take traffic out of cities not force it into them.Those roundabouts wouldn't be that bad if people only knew how to read road markings, or if they can read them, obey them, don't block the exits!!!
Peter, york says...
1:11pm Fri 28 Sep 07
A user, Selby says...
1:15pm Fri 28 Sep 07
TooRad, york says...
1:30pm Fri 28 Sep 07
By the way what's an echo warrior? Are they concerned about their carbon-ricochet?
see sense, york says...
1:31pm Fri 28 Sep 07
If it was a duel carriageway you wouldn't need roundabouts
Interesting concept I am sure noddy.
Please explain further how traffic travelling accross the ring road will be able to do it across a dual carriageway without roundabouts or flyovers. Do know something that no traffic planner has ever thought of ?
clifton moor, cliftonmoor says...
1:35pm Fri 28 Sep 07
Jack, York says...
1:40pm Fri 28 Sep 07
andyb, york says...
1:52pm Fri 28 Sep 07
Noddy1, York says...
1:59pm Fri 28 Sep 07
see sense wrote:Of course fly overs will be needed but as I keep repeating this dueling won't happen as it will COST FAR TO MUCH. Why do you think the highways agency gave it to York? They knew that when the by-pass was built that it was out of date and as quick as possible off loaded it to York council.
If it was a duel carriageway you wouldn't need roundaboutsInteresting concept I am sure noddy. Please explain further how traffic travelling accross the ring road will be able to do it across a dual carriageway without roundabouts or flyovers. Do know something that no traffic planner has ever thought of ?
The hopgrove roundabout does need something doing with it but the A64 from there to scarbourgh will be dueled before the A1237.
Lets see how long the highways agency keeps the A64 before it off loads it onto York, they're only interested in the motorways.
Captain Jack Sparrow, Strensall says...
2:45pm Fri 28 Sep 07
andyb wrote:Its nice that you think this way but look at Russia, China, America, India, parts of the far east, parts of South America. These are big world players in the pollutant and poison market.
I`m with Alan Shaw, and Too Rad. Anything we can do to reduce our impact on the planet is worth doing, and a lot can be done without having to be taxed. It has been shown consistently that upgrading roads results in higher use and increased congestion, viz the newbury bypass and the M 25.
An indirect result of all this pollution is the rising cost of living. There's some very bright people in this country trying to keep inflation under control but it's spiralling out of control. Everything is going up - fuel, food etc
Hard times ahead I'm afraid.
There's nothing you can do. As Fraser from dad's army used to say, "We're doomed Laddie, doomed".
bluto, Acomb says...
3:46pm Fri 28 Sep 07
Captain Jack Sparrow wrote:If you took out Tesco's roundabout and made the A19 and A58 slip roads flyovers you could probably alleviate a lot of rush hour snarl ups.
If you took out Tesco's roundabout and made the A19 and A58 slip roads flyovers you could probably alleviate a lot of rush hour snarl ups. In terms of carbon footprints - there's absolutely nothing you can do to stop what is happening to the earth. It's going to get much, much warmer and resources and food will become scarcer. You can wheel out your wheelie bins full of stuff to be recycled. You can drive cars with cleaner engines, there's all sorts you can do. But when the biggest nations on Earth (USA, Russia, China) continue to polute and rape the earth as they do, there isn't much chance.
If you did that Captain all it would do is move the snarl up to another smaller roundabout. What should have happened is that the person that came up with the idea of making it a single carraigway should have been put in some stocks at the Tesco roundabout with a big sign above him saying, "I'm the dickhead that designed this road."
night driver, york says...
4:55pm Fri 28 Sep 07
Peter, york says...
5:39pm Fri 28 Sep 07
A user wrote:Wrong it's not a minority it's the majority, because there so pee'd off having queued from Grimston Bar on the A64 due to the A64 becoming single carriageway just east of the Hopgrove roundabout that they they are jockeying for position & don't give a toss about traffic wishing to travel west from the A1237/A1036. The comment about the Police was to Akuma's benefit, and NOT a serious suggestion
No Peter, the police have better things to do..... It's upto motorists to obey the signs - its part of the highway code. And if the markings are only "advisory" why do the majority take heed. Once agin its the minority who cause the problems - look at the Army & Strensall common for example - in fact no disregard that.... we'll be here all day. As always, advice is there for a reason.
Paul Hepworth, York says...
6:33pm Fri 28 Sep 07
Julian currently enjoys the luxury of not having to heed any advice from Transport Planning professionals. If elected, he will have to accept the reality of suppressed demand being released by road expansion.
Check www.roadblock.org.uk for a look at the future that Julian and his supporters espouse.
ALD, York says...
7:08pm Fri 28 Sep 07
New Labour supporter, Huntington says...
7:33pm Fri 28 Sep 07
andyb, york says...
8:30pm Fri 28 Sep 07
New Labour supporter wrote:Take the train or the bus. I tried it the other day and it`s not such a bad experienceplus you get some excercise going to the station.
Unbelievable that some people still come out with the old argument that ALL road building is bad for the environment. Moving traffic is less harmful than gridlocked, and I ask you what is the public transport alternative to sitting in queues on the by pass?
Paul Hepworth, York says...
8:31pm Fri 28 Sep 07
New Labour supporter wrote:So your answer to gridlock is to increase road capacity which will be a short term "cure." You haven't answered the vital question of how you will tackle the additional journeys that a wider road will inevitably generate, which will eventually bring back gridlock on an even bigger scale. Blinkered vision fails to spot viscious circle........
Unbelievable that some people still come out with the old argument that ALL road building is bad for the environment. Moving traffic is less harmful than gridlocked, and I ask you what is the public transport alternative to sitting in queues on the by pass?
andyb, york says...
10:46pm Fri 28 Sep 07
XXX wrote:when you`e up to you ankles in water you might like to rethink what you wrote there. A 14 metre rise in sea level would see parts of york and most of selby underwater.
Mullarkian wrote:Hit it on the nose
Which planet is Alan Shaw on? Certainly not this one if he believes all that tosh that government sponsored scientists spout about carbon foot prints and the environment. All that is, is another excuse to tax people more.
Geoff, says...
1:31am Sat 29 Sep 07
Cari wrote:Tough!
Dual the ringroad and put in flyovers where possible. Clost the junctions where flyovers are not possible. The purpose of a ringroad is to get people round the city to their destination.And what about all those that due to the closure of some of the junctions have to travel further to get to their destinations?
New Labour supporter, Huntington says...
9:32pm Sat 29 Sep 07
Long on tree hugging, short on solutions!
Stu M, Knaresborough says...
8:53pm Mon 19 Nov 07
Julian Sturdy
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bjb, York says...
8:15am Fri 28 Sep 07
Have I missed something here? The ring ring road has been like this since it was built.